Converting a 'telly' to more of an ASAT classic custom

[gaxeman]

I've got this warmoth partsocaster telly (all Fender parts) that can't hold a stick up to my G&L ASAT special. But I love the rosewood, so I have to modify it if I'm not getting rid of it.

Considered the configuration of the ASAT classic custom as a possibility (large MFD neck, standard MFD bridge), or another option would be a large MFD neck with a S500 bridge pup in the bridge. Would require cutting/filing the pickguard, not sure yet if any routing would be needed, but it wouldn't be a problem.

Is the large MFD/S500 bridge a decent combination, or should I stick with the classic custom config? Any thoughts welcome, this is the first basic decision. Holy cow, yet another possibility is the ASAT Bluesboy 90 config with the P90 in the neck. Help!

Will the standard MFD or S500 bridge pup would fit in the bridge slot for the telly? I don't want to change to a different type bridge, since that might require extensive refinishing the top to get it to look good - prefer to avoid any cosmetic wood work.

I'm assuming I should replace most or all of the electronics (needs it anyways, existing pots are iffy), noticed a G&L ASAT Tribute Special wiring harness on ebay, would that be a good way to go, or should I be only considering US G&L parts inside?

Is there anything else I ain't thinking of that is going to make this like opening a can of worms? Thanks for any ideas!!

[louis cyfer]

s500 won't work in the bridge, the mfd asat classic pup will. i would recommend staying with the small mfd asat classic neck pup as well.

[supereiv]

I have a classic custom and a classic s, I agree with Louis, stick with the ASAT classic pickups they'll do well.

[gaxeman]

Thanks for the replies! Could I ask why the S500 bridge pup wouldn't work? - is it a matter of not matching with the ASAT mfd, or a change would be needed to electronics, doesn't fit right, or what? Also why not a large mfd in the neck, is it a matter of personal preference for the pups, to reduce modification needed to the pickguard, or something else? Sorry if it seems like I'm being a jerk about this. It's just that I kind of had my mind set on the classic custom setup (large and small mfd), mostly because of wanting one more guitar with a large mfd, I think it's my favorite single coil.

[blargfromouterspace]

The S-500 pickup would require new mounting holes in the bridge be drilled, and most likely a corresponding hole in the body. Give that the ashtray bridge is barely wide enough to cover the ends of the pickup route as is, you'd almost certainly have to do some cosmetic work on the guitar. It's probably not different enough to the bridge MFD found in the ASAT Classic to make it worthwhile.

As for the pickups, it's entirely up to you. If you're set on the Classic Custom config then go for it. I'd buy a new pick-guard to mangle and keep the old one as is just in case you don't like the results.

No need to replace the electronics. The Tribute wiring harness would work, but it sounds like you only need to replace the pots, so just buy them. No need to use the ones G&L does, and any good quality pots (such as CTS) from ebay or wherever will work just fine.

[gaxeman]

Thanks blarg, sounds like what I was thinking and gives me confidence to move on. Never did a mod like this, have only replaced a couple of broken things (switches, tuners).

I've got Dan Erlewine's book on guitar repair, he mentions Fender a zillion times but I've never seen anything in there on G&L. Sorta wish sometimes G&L had just gone with Fender compatible sizes. (that sound you just heard was me ducking from the rotten fruit being thrown)

I'll post pics once I get some stuff and get this going, might be a couple weeks.

[supereiv]

One more thing to notice is that it could be hard to find a classic custom neck pickup, it is not the same as the special neck pickup.

[blargfromouterspace]

Sorta wish sometimes G&L had just gone with Fender compatible sizes. (that sound you just heard was me ducking from the rotten fruit being thrown)

For the most part they are. The bridge, pickups and internal electronics (the important hardware) on the ASAT Classic are essentially the same as Fender. So is the wiring. The only couple of parts that are different are the 'trim' - the pick guard and the control plate. If you have any trouble let us know, always happy to help.

[louis cyfer]

as blarg said, the asat classic uses fender sizes. the s500 pup will not fit in the route, or in the bridge, the mounting holes are in the wrong place. try to put a strat pup in a tele. same problem. you'll have a hard time finding the classic custom neck pup. since you have a special with the large mfd, why not do the small mfd of the classic?

[gaxeman]

Thanks again guys. Didn't realize the classic custom neck pup was different than a special neck pup. I was just going to go with the large mfd, like in the G&L online store. It does make more sense to just go with the classic config. This guitar would then basically replace the white 30th anniversary ASAT I showed in my introduction post, that I stupidly sold. Thanks for setting me straight! Was planning on getting 250K CTS pots from Stew Mac.

But I noticed a difference Fender-G&L electronics, the G&L support page schematic for ASAT shows a .1u cap and a 200p cap, the standard telecaster diagram I have shows only one .05u cap. I'm assuming now that's what's in this one, will check in a few days. But that's why I was considering the prewired ASAT harness. (Ok, also because I'm lazy. I'd probably pay someone to do this mod, if I wasn't too lazy to find someone qualified and take it to them )

Any thoughts on the difference in caps, please let me know, thanks!

[louis cyfer]

the mfd's are brighter, so i would go with the cap values g&l uses. the second cap is a treble bleed if i am correct.

[gaxeman]

Thanks, yeah I just got it. Stewmac calls it treble bypass and explains it here:

http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/Electro ... 000_5.html

The guitar repair manual I have shows the one cap for telly, but on stewmac I see there are two:

http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/i-3191.html

That's same as ASAT except each of the ASAT caps are double the value of the Fender's. Wouldn't you know it, stewmac doesn't carry the .1u size except in the cheap ceramic version. I'm looking elsewhere now, hate to go cheap when I've come this far!

[louis cyfer]

here is the best source for electronic components. http://www.mouser.com/ i would never get anything from stew mac. i prefer bourne pots as well. mouser is cheaper as well.

[gaxeman]

Thanks again louis! That mouser site sure gives you an incredible choice.

Figured some experimentation was called for, so ordered some CTS pots 250k, 5% tolerance, and for caps I ordered silver mica 180p (where the schematic shows 200p), and .033u sprague orange drops (where the schematic shows .1). If that last one ends up making it too bright, I can try a larger value. But I was noticing some desiring to reduce the capacitance from the standard.

Curious about the mfd mounting, I've seen screw hole at each end, and 3 screws top and bottom in a triangle shape:

http://www.glguitars.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=241

http://www.ebay.com/itm/121137791492?ss ... 1436.l2649

Is that one is bridge, one is neck, and the triangle shape goes to the bridge? Sorry, this is my last question before I order the pups!

[blargfromouterspace]

http://www.glguitars.com/shopping/shopexd.asp?id=241

http://www.ebay.com/itm/121137791492?ss ... 1436.l2649

Is that one is bridge, one is neck, and the triangle shape goes to the bridge? Sorry, this is my last question before I order the pups!

Yep. Triangle at the bridge.

[gaxeman]

Is anyone here knowledgeable about the differences in the wiring between a standard telly and the ASAT Classic?

There's variations in component values, and a small resistance (6.8K) added between the bottom tab of the tone pot and ground, that last one I believe to get a more usable range of tone control.

http://www.glguitars.com/schematics/ASA ... rawing.pdf

http://www.glguitars.com/schematics/ASA ... iagram.pdf

http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/i-3191.html

But my question is, it looks to me like the main tone cap was moved in the ASAT. Telly schematics I see have the cap between the middle tab of the tone pot and the ground tab of the volume pot (or simply, middle of tone pot to ground). The ASAT schematics above show the cap between the middle of the tone pot to the top of the tone pot (or middle of tone pot to hot). Anyone able to shed light on this change?

I am changing an existing telly wiring to add G&L ASAT Classic MFD's, would like to understand why I would change the existing capacitor connections, thanks for any insight! Already have all my parts, and plan to rewire her this coming week.

[Elwood]

hmmm...good question. I'm going to open my 80's ASAT's ( only one is bone stock)to see whats going on. It appears the same circuit is used for the Classics .
elwood
p.s. I see the schematic putting the tone cap between tab 1 and 2 of the pot, am I reading it wrong ? (henceforth to the ASAT's at hand )

[louis cyfer]

Is anyone here knowledgeable about the differences in the wiring between a standard telly and the ASAT Classic?

There's variations in component values, and a small resistance (6.8K) added between the bottom tab of the tone pot and ground, that last one I believe to get a more usable range of tone control.

http://www.glguitars.com/schematics/ASA ... rawing.pdf

http://www.glguitars.com/schematics/ASA ... iagram.pdf

http://www.stewmac.com/freeinfo/i-3191.html

But my question is, it looks to me like the main tone cap was moved in the ASAT. Telly schematics I see have the cap between the middle tab of the tone pot and the ground tab of the volume pot (or simply, middle of tone pot to ground). The ASAT schematics above show the cap between the middle of the tone pot to the top of the tone pot (or middle of tone pot to hot). Anyone able to shed light on this change?

I am changing an existing telly wiring to add G&L ASAT Classic MFD's, would like to understand why I would change the existing capacitor connections, thanks for any insight! Already have all my parts, and plan to rewire her this coming week.

it's still getting grounded either way, so they should both work. the asat grounds through a resistor, but that is about it. the asat tone is kinda wired like a volume, with the middle leg splitting the signal with the ground.

[bonecrusher]

That is a gorgeous guitar!